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  • #46
    Originally posted by bumblebeex3 View Post
    Omg I am so mad I didn't see this thread when it was first posted and active because I actually have a lot of thoughts about this. I read through every post and it seems that even in the year since you posted this thread, Trey, I haven't seen most of these members around! So sad.

    So like I said I have a lot of thoughts on this so sorry if this gets lengthy!! I agree with pretty much everything everyone has already said, here is my own take.

    I have been coming to these boards since 2003 or 2004. There have been periods during that time where I was inactive for months but I always ended up coming back eventually. Like others have said message boards in general were so popular back in the day and I too belonged to a few different ones besides this community. And, like others, this is the only one I still participate on. I was always pulled back in.

    ^^^!!!!!this!!!!!^^^ So. Accurately. Describes. Me.!!!!

    The post ranks and reps were always a huge incentive to me. I'd spend hours a night on the hints and tips boards to increase my post count and earn reps. Everyone enjoys the boards for different reasons, but that was the reason I was really interested in coming on for a long time. I hardly ventured outside of hints and tips.

    I was under 13 when I joined the boards to get help in MHM. My friends also played ND and we would talk about them and play them together all the time. But as we got older they stopped playing the games. I probably would have stopped too if the boards did not exist. I continued to play them because I was so determined to stay up to date on the hints and tips. You can't help people if you haven't played the game!

    That's not to say that I forced myself to play the games. Not at all! I've always enjoyed them. But the message boards kept me interested in HeR and the games a lot longer than I think my general interest would have. I'd probably have moved on from them when I was 16 if I didn't come online every day determined to become a Junior Sleuth, Sleuth and beyond. (Remember when the ranks were cool and vibrant like that?? )

    And the boards were hopping! It wasn't hard to increase post count. I started to explore Signature Heights, the AEs, partner plays and MB games. I got attached! I watched the boards change from teal to burgundy to white and each change saw less members. That is definitely a huge factor in today's numbers. There was such a steep drop from the already dwindling activity in - idk, when did the new format come out, 2014? I was also sad because the reps were changed and the detective ranks were changed and it was all different and not as appealing anymore.

    And now less people even need help in their games because there are so many online walkthroughs and in game spoilers. Plus, like everyone on this thread has already said, the community has moved to other social media outlets because there is more freedom there. The rules here are pretty crazy, we can all agree. Its a huge turnoff for people. (Trust me, I've gotten warnings/infractions myself. I know the sting! sorry!!! <3 )

    The internet is so different now than it was back when the rules were created and so its really hard for people to come back here and accommodate them all after going on Tumblr, Twitter or Facebook where you can pretty much do and say anything you want lol. I'd love to see the Mystery Cafe or something similar re-instated within some reason. Other message boards I've been on had User Notes which are cute and would be fun here. Just some fun little extra things, maybe lighten the rules a bit. I don't think this will ever happen though, sadly.

    So even though it seems the number of active members dwindles every year, I still plan to stick around. It's become so habitual for me to pop on here a few times a day to see whats going on. At this time I can't see myself not coming on. There are still fun MB games going and some interesting discussions here and there. And while I do follow HeR on their other media outlets this is still somehow where I get a majority of my HeR/ND related news. I guess we'll see what happens in the future.
    Absolutely agree! :D I know I've already posted about it before on here, but it's been a while :P I would be long gone from the games if this community wasn't here. I think this community really is vital to the existence of the ND games, in many ways. Why else would this be literally the only point and click PC game series left in 2016? A lot of fans have left, obviously, but many have stayed because of these forums. I do agree about the harsh rules and wish they could be lessened a bit :P Obviously they were created at the very beginning when there were lots of young kids (including many that now remain on here!) whose parents wouldn't want them on some completely open forum. It was good to have safety. But now that most of us seem to be in our late teens/early 20s, I feel like there could be some rule changes to lighten up the kind of dumb ones I don't want this to become like some forum with tons of swears and PI being thrown out in an unsafe way at all, I just feel like there could be some kind of pointless rules removed. Maybe with the new Codes and Clues series coming out there could be a new separate forum connected to this forum with the same strict rules to hopefully attach the new, young fans onto a community like we all have experienced. If you're under a certain age, you wouldn't be able to access these forums, just the Codes and Clues one. Then HeR could maybe lighten up on these rules, or bring back something like bbx3 mentioned with the Mystery Cafe which I've always heard about and wanted to experience X) I don't know, it's probably just wishful thinking. But this community could probably do for a rule update. We aren't children anymore!

    Oh, and I just thought of something else! I recently saw a post on I think Reddit that was discussing how people loved these forums but a lot of people get scared away because they break a dumb rule that really is so insignificant, then get a warning by a mod just doing their job. I remember when I got my first. It was terrifying. I've been somewhat of a rulebreaker (though not even on purpose which shows that if I can't remember all the rules sometimes, little kids surely wouldn't :P) so I've gotten a little bit used to seeing the notification that I have a warning, but even so, my heart still jumps into my throat like OH NO what have I done!?!? XD So yeah, the rule system I think has scared off it's fair share of users too :P After all, we have like 100,000 users, but only what, like, a 1000 active ones? If that :P
    Last edited by Ndfan1234; January 23, 2016, 07:21 PM.
    To the message boards: When I think of this place, I think of the many wonderful memories and friends that I made here as a young teen (some of which I have to this day!). I would just like to say thank you to everyone who made this place special and added so much joy to my life. From alternate endings, to entertaining message board games, to picking through the details of every game, to being so excited when a new game was released, to speculating if MID would ever come out, and of course to the time where so many of us sleuthed every inch of CRE to find that darn (fake) easter egg , I have had so much fun here and made so many memories. The boards may be all but dead but I will forever cherish this place, even if I never return to it. Thank you to you all

    My threads:

    Olivia Trey Penelope


    • #47
      Wow, I wish I had seen this thread a while ago! I can't remember the last time I've posted something outside of a long-term GP I'm in. I must say, I've been here since 2010, so I consider myself a veteran to the games at this point. From what I've noticed, the boards follow a trend based on a few things: majority demographic, appeal, games.
      Majority Demographic: "Waves" of people are Nancy Drew fans. For example, my generation generally does not enjoy a good computer game. However, it seems the decade younger than me enjoy them because they're "trendy". Things go out of style and back into it, and I think right now video game consoles are the way that gamers go when they first begin.
      Appeal: Some have mentioned basically what I mean here. When the message boards changed from burgundy to white, I was devastated. I felt like it was a change of the company and it made me feel like I was a new gamer all over again. Another thing is the strict rules. Social media is a much more free outlet of your opinion, rather than a message board that won't let you say all kinds of things, or really establish a real network of friends. And if you managed to make friends, at some point, the majority of them stop visiting the boards, making you feel alone. There used to be a subscriber list that people could use, but it's gone now. Overall, the message boards no longer feel like the homey, welcoming, hodgepodge that we all came to love.
      Games: Maybe somebody has mentioned this, but maybe not. The message boards are based around the games. If there are no new games out, many people, especially ones who are not involved in other boards, will see not point of logging into the message boards, so they won't. Forget the quality decline of games (which I personally think HeR was getting better with), if there's nothing new to play, there's nothing new to discuss. The board that has the most popularity right now is Game Rumors. Why? We're seeking something new to talk about, whether it be the new game, our opinions on HeR as a company, anything really. All of the other boards have already seen their time, and most of it is repetition of the same games, same questions, etc., etc.

      Thank you for reading my rant of what I've wanted to say for the past year I haven't been active.
      . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . * * *
      " be silly, be honest, be kind. "
      . •- ralph waldo emerson.

      Thanks Katelyn Ann! These are words to live by!
      R.I.P. Ryan and Marvin 10/3/14 <3 Fly high boys
      R.I.P. Erin, my beautiful angel 12/22/15


      • #48
        Please forgive me if I'm repeating something that has already been said. I saw this post and I just had to write in here... I fall into that category. I think I've been absent for over 2 years from the boards... and yet been a member for over 10 now! I kind of 'grew up here' and it was a part of my life... then like you said, the games slowly started changing. I thought it was just ME that was changing but then I saw it was the games. I gradually lost interest and the 'fun' was lost. It's sad how that happens.

        I'm not sure what happened with Nancy's voice character changing, I think we lost a CEO? Then the focus of the games seemed to get darker, and yet more predictable? They started inter-weaving the same jokes, plots, and items into so many of the stories they were no longer unique! It became like a good movie that they make 3 of then try to do a 4 and 5 and 6 or something! Perhaps they SHOULD quit while they are ahead. Or start something slightly new entirely. It's time for Nancy Drew to go to the next phase and leave what WAS behind. It will never be the same I'm afraid. :(
        Spread the word! On
        March 5
        We're going to set a new
        HER Record
        click here for more info

        The HeR message boards taught me to be a girl who "isn't afraid"
        and to pursue my dreams! THESE very boards made me the
        creative girl I am today... thank you Herians! Though I don't have
        much time for ND these days, I sign in now and again to see
        what 'fun' is still being had here. -Penny


        • #49
          I just wanted to elaborate on what I said about the rules a bit. Yes they're strict but unfortunately they're still quite necessary. Time after time its been proven that when given leniency people will push the boundaries - even with the best of intentions. It's really a classic case of "this is why we can't have nice things" lol.

          I've come to accept the boards for what they are though I understand that's hard for a lot of people to do. But it still would be really nice to have some designated areas for things. I have no idea how that would work, but it's nice to dream! (I'm a dork and this is what I think about in my downtime haha).

          Also the community as a whole, on the boards and elsewhere, has become pretty negative tbh. Both about the difference in the newer games and changes at the company itself. I know its turned me off of keeping up with some of the discussions on here and on other sites so that could be another contributing factor to the low traffic on the boards as well.


          • #50
            Originally posted by bumblebeex3 View Post
            I just wanted to elaborate on what I said about the rules a bit. Yes they're strict but unfortunately they're still quite necessary. Time after time its been proven that when given leniency people will push the boundaries - even with the best of intentions. It's really a classic case of "this is why we can't have nice things" lol.

            I've come to accept the boards for what they are though I understand that's hard for a lot of people to do. But it still would be really nice to have some designated areas for things. I have no idea how that would work, but it's nice to dream! (I'm a dork and this is what I think about in my downtime haha).

            Also the community as a whole, on the boards and elsewhere, has become pretty negative tbh. Both about the difference in the newer games and changes at the company itself. I know its turned me off of keeping up with some of the discussions on here and on other sites so that could be another contributing factor to the low traffic on the boards as well.
            I dont think it is bad to have rules since kids are on the boards, but the way the warnings are given are written in a very harsh way that I think it can be traumatic to children and also push people away.

            Once I tried to answer a question on the hints and tips board, and I received such a harsh response because they said that i answered a question that was already answered, but I had only given more information because the original answer was kind of confusing and referred to another game that maybe someone wouldn't know. I have never gone on the hints and tips board again.

            HeR can enforce the rules without making you feel like a total criminal, ,especially when you are trying to help someone

            @Hoppy227, I remember when the message boards were teal!!!


            • #51
              Over the internet its easy for things to get lost in translation. The intention isn't to be overly stern or harsh and certainly not to discourage people from visiting parts of the board but I agree they can come across that way because the whole thing is pretty intimidating. You're browsing the boards then you suddenly get that dreaded pop-up with WARNING or INFRACTION glaring out at you. Trust me I know how it feels - I've gotten several myself, my heart would drop and I'd be like "Omg what did I do".

              We've tried to get the titles to change from "warning" to "reminder" since that's more of what it is and sounds less scary; but it's a built in part of the boards that can't be altered.
              Last edited by bumblebeex3; January 25, 2016, 02:42 PM. Reason: typos!


              • #52
                Originally posted by bumblebeex3 View Post
                Also the community as a whole, on the boards and elsewhere, has become pretty negative tbh. Both about the difference in the newer games and changes at the company itself. I know its turned me off of keeping up with some of the discussions on here and on other sites so that could be another contributing factor to the low traffic on the boards as well.
                This. Last year, I was gone from HeR for months, mostly because of this reason. In all seriousness, the boards were like an episode of As The HeRth Turns. Not just the negativity of the discussions, but the whole situation in general. For the first time, instead of craving to come on, I began to dread it, so I finally said, "Why keep going back if I'm not enjoying it anymore?" However, it looks like things are getting back to normal, and it is a pleasant experience again, so I hope to stick around now.

                Also, Renny, I would have loved to have the "Warning" changed to "Reminder". Too bad it can't be done.
                Last edited by Royal Payne; January 25, 2016, 02:36 PM.
                Penelope Payne (just a nickname) & company 🦄 Seastar 🐼 Panda 🦔 Phillip the Pygmypuff 🐎 Stardust 🖖 Spock 🐊 Albert the Sheepigator 🌛 Count Vismak


                • #53
                  Just wanna toss my two cents in here and there...pretty much the same as everyone else's, but still...!

                  I have almost quit the boards more than once in the past over rule stuff. I personally found the rules very elaborate and difficult to understand when I was younger (well heck I still do in spots), so I'd think I understood what to do, post, and then discover that I got something wrong. I've only had a few warnings but it would make me mad because of how I'd given so much thought to my post only to have it be wrong - especially when I didn't really think that my post was actually an issue! So yeah, I did make a vow to leave once or twice, but I came back anyway. Now that I'm older, I've come to terms with the rules...although I'm still scared of getting warnings here and there.

                  When it comes to the drama, I agree with Penelope for the most part. After SPY's release, I remember there being a lot of backlash against how it portrayed certain things, and I stuck around to defend the writing (funny, because over time I've become less and less of a fan of SPY, though for different reasons than the members who disliked it!). However since then I've just felt more like keeping quiet for most drama; I like to offer my opinion on some of Her's current actions, but that's mainly because I continue to hope that employees are reading the boards and will see my posts. Outside of that, I've never been a fan of online fighting - one of the reasons I kept defending SPY was because the members with opposing views continued to be very polite, whereas I wouldn't have wanted to engage someone openly argumentative.

                  Now onto why the boards aren't active...I think it's pretty much what Renny said. With other outlets to express yourself freely about the games, the boards aren't going to look too appetizing since the rules can be quite strict. I was personally more active elsewhere for a while because of this. Not only that, but when new fans find the boards, they're probably going to see a community that's edging toward extinction, say "why bother?" and just move on. So it's a cumulative problem and one that can't really be fixed, not without totally dismantling the rules which is something that Her will likely never do (and I understand that completely).

                  Anyway, I'm not about to leave anytime soon, not while the game threads are still active

                  Oh, and about the title of this thread - as weird as this sounds, I think bad games inspire more discussion than good ones. I always end up saying more about negative things...just in general, I think there are more conversations to be had when people are discussing what was wrong with certain aspects of a game or what could be improved.
                  neverending song

                  So far from me walks your dear self
                  So far from me too is your home
                  to which I can never find my way
                  your fairy tale...


                  • #54
                    First off, great post to tsukiakari. I agree that the problem is sort of cumulative, or cause and effect.

                    I'm not sure if the lull in activity is directly because the games have been bad lately, but more that they've been a bit...bland. SPY wasn't a bad game, but I have almost nothing to say about it because it wasn't a) very good or b) very interesting. I don't think Lani leaving is the problem either, because that's one of the few things lately that's sparked conversation up again.

                    A big factor in my opinion is that a lot of people have grown up. Not to imply that you can't be an adult and like Nancy Drew, I'm an adult and I still love the games. But I think as people transition into adulthood life get's busier, people are less inclined to fill free time with the boards.

                    As for me, I've been posting a lot less. I still go on every now and then, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't also a bit inactive. My favorite thing about the game boards used to be discussing the endings of games and the meanings after I played. I've noticed this type of discussion has dropped off, and in it's place there's mostly just games. Which are fun and all, but they don't keep me personally coming back as much.
                    Listen my child to this story of dreams
                    And know that the beginning is more difficult than it seems...


                    • #55
                      I think there is a difference between negativity and critical thinking. With SEA, there were some conversations that I found very uncomfortable because people had a sort of "these are my beliefs and the games should be my way" vibe but when talking about changes in the company and the tone of the games, it is just facing reality and trying to figure out what the problems are and offer solutions to change.

                      I can see how that can come off negative, but the world isnt perfect, and the internet makes it too easy to escape into "perfect places" . I really admire HeR for allowing real discourse about their products on their boards, it shows their integrity. Many other companies just delete anything but praise. Maybe partly because of these discussions, SEA was one of the better games in a long time.


                      • #56
                        I actually logged into my account just to reply to this post! I've been a member since 2008, and it makes me really sad to see people lose interest in the message boards and the games. Personally, I don't have a lot of time to get on the message boards, but I like coming back on every few weeks or so to see if there is any news about the release of MID. I feel like the hints and tips board is no longer important due to walkthroughs/tips on other websites which is unfortunate because I used to love offering others help back when I first joined!

                        I, too, think that there is a lot of negativity on the boards surrounding the changes HER is making, and this is hurting the sense of community. I really wish that we could stay a bit more positive until we know exactly how the new games will be. I'll admit that I'm someone who doesn't like change, but as a dedicated fan I'm willing to give the new platform and the new voice of Nancy a fair chance.

                        I think that the message boards could benefit from some new and exciting threads to get people more involved. This is difficult due to other social media sites, but perhaps if the boards were advertised more on social media new users would sign up...? There could be a bit more leniency in the rules as well.

                        I realize this post isn't much different from what others have said, but as a dedicated fan I felt as though I had to share my thoughts as well :)
                        Do not go where the path may lead, go instead where there is no path and leave a trail .·´♥
                        -Ralph Waldo Emerson


                        • #57
                          I check in every few weeks. Won't be long-winded, but I decided not to purchase games anymore after the firing of Lani, which I thought was a bad business decision and clumsily presented to the fans. (Putting it mildly.)

                          Just now I read a post in a different thread, referring to to dismissal of the creative team and no news of a new team. This suggests to me that HI is floundering and -- as I expected after the delay of the next game was announced -- there may not be a next game. At this point I'd be surprised if the Salem game ever came to fruition.

                          The boards are nothing without the continuation of the games (and the company).

                          That's capitalism. If the company's product is not a commercial success, the company doesn't go on to expensive retooling, reformatting, or hiring a new team and building up the fan base. They've thrown out more baby than bath water, Lani gone, old games' formula gone, team gone, is there any strength or advantage they haven't thrown out?

                          It is sad, but we've got about 30 grand games to cherish. "We'll always have Paris." :)


                          • #58
                            I've been a member of these forums since 2002 (yikes! Feeling old saying that out loud) and I remember well the good ol' days of the teal board and off topic sections. It was a great way for us to connect with one another, form bonds and friendships with people who had similar interests, etc. Being older now I can see how that could place members in a non-safe environment; it would be next to impossible to moderate with all of the various threads going on. With that being said, I do think the strict nature of the rules turns a lot of people off to the forums. I myself have been warned several times throughout my time here on the boards--sometimes for things I deserved, other times for things I did not quite understand. Safety for members is a main concern for HeR, and I get that, but sometimes a little leniency for an accidental double post, or signature that is too long, etc. would probably help promote a more positive view of the forums.

                            I use to come on here every day and check the new posts, but now I rarely ever come on to check anything. With the in-game hints system added it really has rendered the hints and tips boards for those games useless. It makes me sad. I do like the instant help option the games provide, but it makes the games not last nearly as long. I miss the days when you had to come onto the boards and wait for someone else to have completed the game before you could get a hint to help you with yours. I can still remember back to FIN when it first came out, and the frustration I felt when trying to figure out difficult puzzles without any hints or tips because the games hadn't been completed yet. It took longer, but I managed to do it. The early games that I completed with next to no hints or tips are the ones I remember the most. I had only my sleuthing skills to rely on, and it felt so much more rewarding. Then I could use my own knowledge of the games to come on and help others beat their games to get that same rewarding feeling.

                            It makes me sad to think of the demise of HeR and the regular release of Nancy Drew PC games. They're my childhood, and have extended into my adult life, too. I can't imagine my life without these games in it. For that reason, I hope HeR can continue to release games at least once a year. These games mean a lot to a lot of people, and span generations. It would be a shame to see that tradition ended.
                            "It's a dangerous business, Frodo, going out your door. ¸·*¨¯¨*·.¸
                            You step onto the road, and if you don't keep your feet,`·-·*©_`*·.,¸_¸,.·*´¨¯))
                            there's no knowing where you might be swept off to."
                            ~Bilbo Baggins; from The Fellowship of the Ring.


                            • #59
                              I agree. I haven't been on the boards in awhile (I left after HeR fired Lani) so I don't know if I missed something like if HeR sold the company or hired new people, but whatever it was and who's ever in charge, is making really bad decisions in my opinion. They're trying to get new people to play the games and I know that its part of the company's job to get more people to buy the games but they're not sticking to their roots. They're modernizing the games and adding in issues and what they think people want and to me, they're focussing so much on that, that they forget about what the Nancy Drew games are really about. There isn't always a need for change. Companies and businesses are always trying to change for the "better" but in the end it just makes people more frustrated and in this case, disappointed and sad. I also had a huge respect for HeR but when they fired Lani and gave a bunch of mumbo jumbo as an answer for doing so, I lost my respect for them.

                              That's just what I think. And if this continues with all their unnecessary changes, I won't be on the boards or buying the new games. I love the people of the boards and our moderators and discussions we have, but like I said before, if they keep doing this, I won't give anything to HeR anymore (not even my time on the boards) to make my point and for them to actually listen.

                              I will continue to play the games I have at home and cherish the memories but will not buy new games if this keeps up.
                              Hollywood Nights... .. -:|:-
                              .. -:|:- ..............,•*¨¯¨*•, ...... -:|:-
                              ......,•*¨¯¨*•, .....',¸¸,• .....`•. ................•´¯)
                              .....( ... •,¸¸,'.. -:|:- . ..........`×.,¸__¸,.×´ ..•´
                              ......`•. ...................,•*¨¯¨*•, ...........•´
                              ..........`•. ....`•. ....',¸¸,• ....). -:|:- ( ..............,•*¨¯¨*•,
                              .. -:|:- .....`•. . `•. `×.,¸__¸,.×´ .........`×.,¸__¸,.×´ ... •,¸¸,'
                              ..................`•.¸_) .....................................-:|:-

                              ©L.bulldog + Tigerpaw


                              • #60
                                I bookmarked this thread to make sure I'd read it, and I'm glad I did. I logged into my ancient account just to share!

                                I don't know when I totally dropped off the boards, but it's been a long time since I've felt like part of the community. I didn't even know the boards were white until recently! Goes to show how disconnected I am from Nancy and HeR in general.

                                I only recently caught up on all of the games after ASH, and it was...underwhelming at best. There were a few gems but they didn't have the Nancy Drew spark that I loved since I was a kid. My sister passed on her love of Nancy to me, so I've been playing them pretty much since I could hold a mouse. I'm usually thrilled to finish a new game, but for most of the new ones pretty much all I was excited for was to say that I had finished it. No thrill, no suspense (with the exclusion of SPY and GTH, which I enjoyed but can't say I loved). I decided to see if everyone was still on the boards like old times, because I was sure I was the only one who felt this way. I never expected so many people to agree with me, and for the boards to be so inactive. Part of the reason I left the boards was because there was too much, too many posts, that it overwhelmed. It seems, quite unfortunately, that problem is gone now.

                                And the rules, my goodness. I remember getting my first infraction and crying for hours. Something about it induces skin-crawling fear and shame, usually for something small and barely worth an eye bat. I understand why these rules were used when there were so many young members on the boards, but haven't we grown up? It looks to me like most of the people on the boards are old enough to use technology appropriately, even if they haven't been around as long as some of us have. When I look up the Nancy Drew fanbase on other social medias like Twitter and Tumblr, they are so much more freeing and seem to be much more popular than the boards. I can't say I'm surprised.

                                Another problem with the boards is there are no connections. The closest you can get to someone is participating in GP's, commenting on AE's, etc. But if they disappear from the boards, you will never hear from them again. It's scary to have a friend and know you have no other way to contact them. Of course I understand why the rules are implemented, but again, I think most kids and the older users like us know how to be safe online in this day and age. The rules, in my opinion, are too stiff. Infractions are frightening, and there is no freedom.

                                That being said, I'm sure I'll still play the games. Every time I think I'll stop something grabs me again. I still enjoy reading AE's on the boards so I'm sure I'll do that from time to time, but I just don't feel connected anymore, in the way that was so great years ago. It's a combination of the games and the boards, I think, that are turning people off to them. Trying to get used to something that used to be so much better is very hard, and sad. Maybe that's why so many people are leaving, and have left.

                                Sorry for the long rant! Just wanted to put in my two cents.

                                . . ARE WE OUT OF THE WOODS YET?. . ARE WE OUT OF THE
                                WOODS YET?. ARE WE OUT OF THE WOODS YET? . ARE WE OUT
                                OF THE WOODS?. ARE WE IN THE CLEAR YET? ARE WE IN THE
                                CLEAR YET? ARE WE IN THE CLEAR YET? IN THE CLEAR YET?